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"Doing more exercise with less intensity,"
Arthur Jones believes, "has all but
destroyed the actual great value
of weight training. Something
must be done . . . and quickly."
The New Bodybuilding for
Old-School Results supplies
MUCH of that "something."

 

This is one of 93 photos of Andy McCutcheon that are used in The New High-Intensity Training to illustrate the recommended exercises.

To find out more about McCutcheon and his training, click here.

 

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Boyer Coe's Nautilus Experiences
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overfiftylifter

http://www.examiner.com/...oyer-coe-part-3
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

overfiftylifter wrote:
http://www.examiner.com/...-part-3


==Scott==
Very interesting and candid article by Boyer. I think the most telling part is when Arthur stated telling Boyer that he'd never have all the things Arthur did and Boyer said he had something Arthur never would and that was class! Boyer has always had class.
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smanjh

Fantastic interview. Mr. Coe is very admirable for telling the truth as he saw it.

Very valid points are made on training. Those small adjustments did not mean HVT.

I hope his points are not met with the 'either/or' response.

Arthur Jones becoming arrogant and downright stupid at times in the 80's was also surprising. I would never think he would do that with Sharper Image without analyzing what the Sears credit card holders actually bought.

Great interview!
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HeavyHitter32

Coe told me in an e-mail about a year ago that he felt an HIT split routine somewhat similar to what Yates did was more effective than the Nautilus full body sessions.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

smanjh wrote:
Fantastic interview. Mr. Coe is very admirable for telling the truth as he saw it.

Very valid points are made on training. Those small adjustments did not mean HVT.

I hope his points are not met with the 'either/or' response.

Arthur Jones becoming arrogant and downright stupid at times in the 80's was also surprising. I would never think he would do that with Sharper Image without analyzing what the Sears credit card holders actually bought.

Great interview!


Arthur Jones becoming arrogant and downright stupid at times in the 80's was also surprising.
==Scott==
What is surprising about that, especially the arrogant part?? Just like with Boyer's workouts he had his mind set on what he wanted Boyer to do and wouldn't listen to anything to the contrary even if it might have worked better.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

The cam was actually the idea of Gary, Arthur?s oldest son, who was only 17 at the time
==Scott==
I've always wondered that if the cam idea was Gary's then why later on did he go to that hulking giant plate loading Hammer type designs over an even more improved cam machine like a Hutchins machine?? Was it possible the idea was just a fluke and Gary really didn't know much about machine design or was it some kind of cam patent related problem prohibiting him from further cam machine designs??

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Turpin

" Arthur did not take into account that each person has his own speed in which he can focus and train. Arthur placed no importance in the thought process of the trainee."

I think this kind of observation can apply to most experienced trainees. And was what I was attemting to get across on some threads/posts lately.
We all differ in our motivations , and if one is to put forth their `best` effort then expression of ones self in both exercise performance and that of enviroment should not be supressed , lest performance and progress manifests sub-par as a result.

T.

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chasbari

Ohio, USA

When you understand machine design and come to the realization that you can accomplish the same leverage compensation through a simple lever system thus avoiding the cost of machining expensive cams you go with it. Nautilus briefly came out with leverage machines before Gary took it off separately as Hammer once Arthur divested himself of Nautilus to pursue MedX.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

chasbari wrote:
When you understand machine design and come to the realization that you can accomplish the same leverage compensation through a simple lever system thus avoiding the cost of machining expensive cams you go with it. Nautilus briefly came out with leverage machines before Gary took it off separately as Hammer once Arthur divested himself of Nautilus to pursue MedX.


==Scott==
So it was more of a cheaper way to make a machine with the same leverage compensation than a way to make a superior machine but with better cams and weight stacks? A cost factor? I'm guessing there was less of a friction problem as well with Hammer machines?
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crazeeJZ

Turpin wrote:
" Arthur did not take into account that each person has his own speed in which he can focus and train. Arthur placed no importance in the thought process of the trainee."

I think this kind of observation can apply to most experienced trainees. And was what I was attemting to get across on some threads/posts lately.
We all differ in our motivations , and if one is to put forth their `best` effort then expression of ones self in both exercise performance and that of enviroment should not be supressed , lest performance and progress manifests sub-par as a result.

T.


True, as much as possible or practical, taylor the training to the trainee.

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chasbari

Ohio, USA

entsminger wrote:
chasbari wrote:
When you understand machine design and come to the realization that you can accomplish the same leverage compensation through a simple lever system thus avoiding the cost of machining expensive cams you go with it. Nautilus briefly came out with leverage machines before Gary took it off separately as Hammer once Arthur divested himself of Nautilus to pursue MedX.

==Scott==
So it was more of a cheaper way to make a machine with the same leverage compensation than a way to make a superior machine but with better cams and weight stacks? A cost factor? I'm guessing there was less of a friction problem as well with Hammer machines?


No chains and decent bearings plus no guide rod friction. Yep. A lot less friction.
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smanjh

entsminger wrote:
smanjh wrote:
Fantastic interview. Mr. Coe is very admirable for telling the truth as he saw it.

Very valid points are made on training. Those small adjustments did not mean HVT.

I hope his points are not met with the 'either/or' response.

Arthur Jones becoming arrogant and downright stupid at times in the 80's was also surprising. I would never think he would do that with Sharper Image without analyzing what the Sears credit card holders actually bought.

Great interview!

Arthur Jones becoming arrogant and downright stupid at times in the 80's was also surprising.
==Scott==
What is surprising about that, especially the arrogant part?? Just like with Boyer's workouts he had his mind set on what he wanted Boyer to do and wouldn't listen to anything to the contrary even if it might have worked better.


For a guy that always criticized everyone else, I expected better.
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summaHIT

Ontario, CAN

It is interesting to hear another view on the Colorado experiment. The fact that Arthur told Viator NOT to lift at all before the "experiment" seems very disigenuous. The fact that Viator only regained his previous mass is not that impressive. The fact that Viator built his frame before using the Nautilus machines and Arthur's protocol is telling.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

summaHIT wrote:
It is interesting to hear another view on the Colorado experiment. The fact that Arthur told Viator NOT to lift at all before the "experiment" seems very disigenuous. The fact that Viator only regained his previous mass is not that impressive. The fact that Viator built his frame before using the Nautilus machines and Arthur's protocol is telling.


==Scott==
That was all clear to me about 2 seconds after I first heard of the Colorado experiment.The part about trying it again with Coe is new to me but I always wondered why Coe looked so small in the video's of him working out at Nautilus. I'm guessing Jones was trying it again and it didn't work this time. Most likely because Coe wouldn't eat everything in sight to put on as much weight as possible?
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Turpin

entsminger wrote:
summaHIT wrote:
It is interesting to hear another view on the Colorado experiment. The fact that Arthur told Viator NOT to lift at all before the "experiment" seems very disigenuous. The fact that Viator only regained his previous mass is not that impressive. The fact that Viator built his frame before using the Nautilus machines and Arthur's protocol is telling.


==Scott==
That was all clear to me about 2 seconds after I first heard of the Colorado experiment.The part about trying it again with Coe is new to me but I always wondered why Coe looked so small in the video's of him working out at Nautilus. I'm guessing Jones was trying it again and it didn't work this time. Most likely because Coe wouldn't eat everything in sight to put on as much weight as possible?


Or as Mentzer had intimated , Viator was on steroids for the duration of the experiment.
Which along with the variables of a prior starvation plan and zero training that Coe implies happened makes the `experiment` less than valid in terms of a training experiment.

T.
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coomo

So Boyer failed to make any progress training Nautilus Style" Yet gained 20lbs in a few mnoths when he reverted to his standard training.I think we can read that as "Nautilus training is too hard,I couldnt or wouldnt work as the required intensity, so I prefered to go back to HVT and juice"
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Bullen-Whatling

coomo wrote:
So Boyer failed to make any progress training Nautilus Style" Yet gained 20lbs in a few mnoths when he reverted to his standard training.I think we can read that as "Nautilus training is too hard,I couldnt or wouldnt work as the required intensity, so I prefered to go back to HVT and juice"


Yeah - I've watched the videos of Mentzer (Ray and Mike) training Boyer Coe, and he doesn't really seem to go to failure, maybe 1-2 reps short.

Rob
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summaHIT

Ontario, CAN

coomo wrote:
So Boyer failed to make any progress training Nautilus Style" Yet gained 20lbs in a few mnoths when he reverted to his standard training.I think we can read that as "Nautilus training is too hard,I couldnt or wouldnt work as the required intensity, so I prefered to go back to HVT and juice"


LOL
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db144

Coomo:

In the article he broke down the Nautilus workout into Upper and Lower body HIT training. He said AJ was stuck on a single full body workout and told AJ he thought it would work better split up.

d
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Turpin

coomo wrote:
So Boyer failed to make any progress training Nautilus Style" Yet gained 20lbs in a few mnoths when he reverted to his standard training.I think we can read that as "Nautilus training is too hard,I couldnt or wouldnt work as the required intensity, so I prefered to go back to HVT and juice"


Actually , I was surprised to find that Coe trained in a style/manner back then other than nautilus/HIT.
Almost all of the pics Ive seen of him have been in reference to ( or associated with ) Jones & nautilus and HIT , and likewise with Viator.

T.
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

==Scott==
An even better quote from Boyer from part one of the article...
"I will agree with Dorian Yates, when he recently commented on the internet. He said that all people who hide behind the keyboards on these blog sites should be required to use their real names and post an actual photo of themselves"
Gee, I wonder how many that includes on just this site??

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smanjh

entsminger wrote:
==Scott==
An even better quote from Boyer from part one of the article...
"I will agree with Dorian Yates, when he recently commented on the internet. He said that all people who hide behind the keyboards on these blog sites should be required to use their real names and post an actual photo of themselves"
Gee, I wonder how many that includes on just this site??



LOL. Too true.
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smanjh

Turpin wrote:
entsminger wrote:
summaHIT wrote:
It is interesting to hear another view on the Colorado experiment. The fact that Arthur told Viator NOT to lift at all before the "experiment" seems very disigenuous. The fact that Viator only regained his previous mass is not that impressive. The fact that Viator built his frame before using the Nautilus machines and Arthur's protocol is telling.


==Scott==
That was all clear to me about 2 seconds after I first heard of the Colorado experiment.The part about trying it again with Coe is new to me but I always wondered why Coe looked so small in the video's of him working out at Nautilus. I'm guessing Jones was trying it again and it didn't work this time. Most likely because Coe wouldn't eat everything in sight to put on as much weight as possible?

Or as Mentzer had intimated , Viator was on steroids for the duration of the experiment.
Which along with the variables of a prior starvation plan and zero training that Coe implies happened makes the `experiment` less than valid in terms of a training experiment.

T.


Never understood why Viator being on steroids during the experiment is so hard to admit. People here claimed Mike could not have known. Well, I am sure Viator would have told him when they hung out. Somehow those two knowing each other and talking is probably not credible enough for the board. (unless they tested Viator, there really is no proof either way).

Then again, we have AJ trying to link Ocean Spray and Nautilus for whatever reason. Who would ever believe that AJ was after anything but profit all along?

Kind of makes you rethink the full body circuit routine too. You needed all those machines to do it, probably several lines of them for multiple customers. Conveniently, they would all be done working out very quickly as well. Genius business really.
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sgb2112

Another guy who without the needle is nothing. Probably has the test level of a twelve year old girl going clean.
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tompuderbaugh

Hey guys....Don't slam Boyer too hard if you have never met him.

I have talked to him personally several times (going back before Nautilus, during Nautilus and after) and you couldn't ask for a nicer gentleman.

Always behaved himself (unlike many of the "stars" back then) and didn't have a cross word to say about anyone.

The Iron Game could use more just like him.

Good training to all.
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