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"Doing more exercise with less intensity,"
Arthur Jones believes, "has all but
destroyed the actual great value
of weight training. Something
must be done . . . and quickly."
The New Bodybuilding for
Old-School Results supplies
MUCH of that "something."

 

This is one of 93 photos of Andy McCutcheon that are used in The New High-Intensity Training to illustrate the recommended exercises.

To find out more about McCutcheon and his training, click here.

 

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jroach

Just got through the two Nautilus bulletins and i have to say (with considerable effort) I'm sorry to Josh Trentine. I *think* I get where you're coming from a little better now.

And if Im correct, the crux of Renx is the equipment, specifically the ergonomics and on-the-fly nature of it. With enough adjustment you should be able to get a trainee to start inroading very far very fast. Not that Art didn't want that, but he admitted the equipment available wouldn?t do it, at least not for a beginner trainee.

?To a new trainee, however, the "resistance curve" of such a machine might not ?probably would not ?
feel perfectly smooth ?but this is to be expected, because the "resistance curve" is balanced to exactly match the "strength curve" of an individual with balanced development, perfectly proportionate development? Eventually, however, after the machine has been used properly for a reasonable period of time, the movements will start to feel perfectly smooth??

So Art purposefully designed machines that wouldn?t be optimal for beginners, and even worse for the lay weightlifter who had developed in an unbalanced way. But to hear him say it, he intended to use the machines only to supplement barbell training, the original 8 exercises with no friction.

Were he to have RenX, he would have the (near) frictionless motion minus the potentially dangerous barbell to worry about, and could probably have junked the bar save for stiff-legged dead lifts. However, it seems that before he could perfect the machine his attention turned to medicine and more scientific testing ? kudos.

The other thing I kept getting stuck on was the low weights and long TULs, not that I had a theoretically grounded reason for it, I was just used to more weight = more better cause no one ever challenged me on it, and whatever I read glossed over the physics that Art stresses so hard : force production does not equal to strength production.

?When a subject is capable of rapidly performing 20 repetitions in the full squat with 400 pounds, then his
squatting strength for one repetition is about as high as it will ever be and if not, then it can be built to a maximum level of strength by continuing the practice ?and if not, then it can be built to a maximum level of strength by continuing the practice until such time as 30 or 40 repetitions become possible? => Gnarly

It?s confusing to someone who?s never disengaged from the threads to just read for a while, but I immediately came to this conclusion : Art said a whole lot of stuff, and not in the clearest particular order. He goes from boasting about some ridiculous lift by some grizzly bear he trained to talking about how harsh muscular skeletal loading is unnecessary.
Like the Bible, the bulletin covers a range of stuff, and someone with an agenda can focus on one area and claim it as ?the message?. But he always includes words of caution along with the outlandish stories, and the most repeated, consistent messages he directed at the largest number of people, these things all agree with SS tenets, at least as presented on the boards. In other words, bring him back to life and he should agree with Renx, in principle.

I?ve now seen most of the disagreements with RenX here, and they boil down to two groups: 1) old-school lifter who is happy with his results and doesn't care enough about a %increase in strength that might be marginal to him, 2) people who think that trolling a board that talks about the top 0.1% of trainees and the counterintuitive things they get away with puts them in that top 0.1%. 3) South Beach, I forgot he?s in his own weight class.

Not that i fully get RenEx or SuperSlow, but I think I understand better the difference between them and Jones's original HIT a little better.

That being said, I would have to be in the first group as to RenX. Not that I?m old skool and huge, but I can gain enough muscle for myself whenever I want to, and I?m no longer a 16 year old red hot out to compete with the world.

Several others have posted to this effect and I no longer see it as a criticism to call Renx out of reach due to price and logistics, it?s just the truth, a place like that will always attract the rich and the injured/ill first and foremost.
But it?s not knocking your program, that would be like making fun of your Ferrarri from my Civic because I ?saved? money ? I admit that given the money im buying the Ferrari, who wouldn't? But in the meantime, I?m cold chillin in my Saab?.
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Joshua Trentine

Ohio, USA

jroach wrote:
Just got through the two Nautilus bulletins and i have to say (with considerable effort) I'm sorry to Josh Trentine. I *think* I get where you're coming from a little better now.

And if Im correct, the crux of Renx is the equipment, specifically the ergonomics and on-the-fly nature of it. With enough adjustment you should be able to get a trainee to start inroading very far very fast. Not that Art didn't want that, but he admitted the equipment available wouldn?t do it, at least not for a beginner trainee.

?To a new trainee, however, the "resistance curve" of such a machine might not ?probably would not ?
feel perfectly smooth ?but this is to be expected, because the "resistance curve" is balanced to exactly match the "strength curve" of an individual with balanced development, perfectly proportionate development? Eventually, however, after the machine has been used properly for a reasonable period of time, the movements will start to feel perfectly smooth??

So Art purposefully designed machines that wouldn?t be optimal for beginners, and even worse for the lay weightlifter who had developed in an unbalanced way. But to hear him say it, he intended to use the machines only to supplement barbell training, the original 8 exercises with no friction.

Were he to have RenX, he would have the (near) frictionless motion minus the potentially dangerous barbell to worry about, and could probably have junked the bar save for stiff-legged dead lifts. However, it seems that before he could perfect the machine his attention turned to medicine and more scientific testing ? kudos.

The other thing I kept getting stuck on was the low weights and long TULs, not that I had a theoretically grounded reason for it, I was just used to more weight = more better cause no one ever challenged me on it, and whatever I read glossed over the physics that Art stresses so hard : force production does not equal to strength production.

?When a subject is capable of rapidly performing 20 repetitions in the full squat with 400 pounds, then his
squatting strength for one repetition is about as high as it will ever be and if not, then it can be built to a maximum level of strength by continuing the practice ?and if not, then it can be built to a maximum level of strength by continuing the practice until such time as 30 or 40 repetitions become possible? => Gnarly

It?s confusing to someone who?s never disengaged from the threads to just read for a while, but I immediately came to this conclusion : Art said a whole lot of stuff, and not in the clearest particular order. He goes from boasting about some ridiculous lift by some grizzly bear he trained to talking about how harsh muscular skeletal loading is unnecessary.
Like the Bible, the bulletin covers a range of stuff, and someone with an agenda can focus on one area and claim it as ?the message?. But he always includes words of caution along with the outlandish stories, and the most repeated, consistent messages he directed at the largest number of people, these things all agree with SS tenets, at least as presented on the boards. In other words, bring him back to life and he should agree with Renx, in principle.

I?ve now seen most of the disagreements with RenX here, and they boil down to two groups: 1) old-school lifter who is happy with his results and doesn't care enough about a %increase in strength that might be marginal to him, 2) people who think that trolling a board that talks about the top 0.1% of trainees and the counterintuitive things they get away with puts them in that top 0.1%. 3) South Beach, I forgot he?s in his own weight class.

Not that i fully get RenEx or SuperSlow, but I think I understand better the difference between them and Jones's original HIT a little better.

That being said, I would have to be in the first group as to RenX. Not that I?m old skool and huge, but I can gain enough muscle for myself whenever I want to, and I?m no longer a 16 year old red hot out to compete with the world.

Several others have posted to this effect and I no longer see it as a criticism to call Renx out of reach due to price and logistics, it?s just the truth, a place like that will always attract the rich and the injured/ill first and foremost.
But it?s not knocking your program, that would be like making fun of your Ferrarri from my Civic because I ?saved? money ? I admit that given the money im buying the Ferrari, who wouldn't? But in the meantime, I?m cold chillin in my Saab?.




this is certainly prerequisite reading for any of our stuff
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Acerimmer1

I'm afraid if I said I was going to read all that I'd be a liar.

What is the upshot?

A)He might be right.
B)He is right but there is room for other people with other views to also be right.
C) You've just don a complete 180 and now instead of this opinion being wrong it is in fact the only opinion which is not wrong.

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db144

jroach and sgb2112:

Be careful if Josh suddenly stops walking both of you will have to wipe the shit off your nose.

d
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db144

What is particularly sad is you are one person with multiple screen names.

d
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Joshua Trentine

Ohio, USA

db144 wrote:
jroach and sgb2112:

Be careful if Josh suddenly stops walking both of you will have to wipe the shit off your nose.

d



4 grade tactics...lol
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db144

Josh do you mean 4th grade tactics? Not tactics but it has been pointed out to me by several people that this is the same person (this person has 5 or 6 active screen names). Why would one run about the forum with multiple screen names?

Also can you honestly say you haven't noticed how jroach and sgb2112 follow you from thread to thread patting you on the back? Do you need a group of yes men following you about stroking your ego?

d
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sgb2112

I am not jroach, I have been on board with the method from day one, so no apologies from me.

I just see RenEx for what it is..a major advancement in the field of exercise. For the vast majority of you guys, it ended in the Hoffman era or at the latest with AJ(at least 1/4 of this board hates HIT with a passion).

You guys are dead-enders.
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RW Hawk

Virgin Islands

sgb2112 wrote:
I just see RenEx for what it is..a major advancement in the field of exercise.


Ditto.

sgb2112 wrote:
For the vast majority of you guys, it ended in the Hoffman era or at the latest with AJ(at least 1/4 of this board hates HIT with a passion).


Bingo.

sgb2112 wrote:
You guys are dead-enders.


So true.

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db144

sgb:

Go do the RenEx suck up on the RenEx thread. Thank you.

d
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RW Hawk

Virgin Islands

Joshua Trentine wrote:
4 grade tactics...lol


So true.

That's all they've got.
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sgb2112

DB..name these "several people" who told you I have multiple screen names..let me guess..the DFT/Platehead/Alactic multiple set crew(on a HIT site no less) lol.

I would like a mod to follow up on this accusation and ban the guilty parties. Give up your sources DB. Loser leaves town!
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db144

LOL, nice mouth sgb. The mods have never been interested in multiple nicks being used here. If they were it would interesting to see which people disappear.

Have you gone to visit Josh in Ohio? Have you tried RenEx? If so then your opinion might be justified but if not, you're running you mouth based on hearsay. Not a good way to go about life.

I have some desert land in Florida I'll sell you for short money. When the cacti bloom its beautiful.


d
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jroach

Whoa guys. I didn't mean this as a discussion piece, just didn't want to pm Josh with this and leave the thought that i was not gonna admit a change of mind in front of the whole forum.
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southbeach

DeadTrap. wrote:
Joshua Trentine wrote:
4 grade tactics...lol

So true.

That's all they've got.
They are not friends of HIT. They do not embrace new knowledge, discovery or the superior technology it beckons. They train the same old ways day after day, year after year (yawn) They worship at the alter of the barbell. It's their religion, their god :/

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crazeeJZ

sgb2112 wrote:
I am not jroach, I have been on board with the method from day one, so no apologies from me.

I just see RenEx for what it is..a major advancement in the field of exercise.


It IS a major advancement when they push as hard as possible on every rep, starting with rep #1, yet they don't have to reduce resistance after each of these max effort reps.

For the vast majority of you guys, it ended in the Hoffman era or at the latest with AJ(at least 1/4 of this board hates HIT with a passion).

You guys are dead-enders.


Dead-enders? Lol, there's a sucker born every minute. Maybe we realize that we are the best machines.

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jitterbug

DeadTrap. wrote:
sgb2112 wrote:
I just see RenEx for what it is..a major advancement in the field of exercise.

Ditto.

sgb2112 wrote:
For the vast majority of you guys, it ended in the Hoffman era or at the latest with AJ(at least 1/4 of this board hates HIT with a passion).

Bingo.

sgb2112 wrote:
You guys are dead-enders.

So true.




DeadTrap & sgb 2112

Agreed! The first advancements since AJ.

Edward
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fbcoach

jitterbug wrote:



DeadTrap & sgb 2112

Agreed! The first advancements since AJ.

Edward


Hahahaha....you are DeadTrap and sggb2112, as well as RW Hawk and a whole host of other fakes. You have to do better than this.

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db144

sgb:

Going to ignore the questions? Have you visited Josh in Ohio and have you tried RenEx? Obviously you'll never reach your potential without the new machines and paying Josh to train you.

d

P.S. You have SB in your corner that should make you feel good. A man who can quote AJ verbatim but won't implement his training methods.
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Joshua Trentine

Ohio, USA

db144 wrote:
Josh do you mean 4th grade tactics? Not tactics but it has been pointed out to me by several people that this is the same person (this person has 5 or 6 active screen names). Why would one run about the forum with multiple screen names?

Also can you honestly say you haven't noticed how jroach and sgb2112 follow you from thread to thread patting you on the back? Do you need a group of yes men following you about stroking your ego?

d



d,

you've accused me of much, but posting here to be popular is perhaps the most laughable accusation.
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sgb2112

"Have you gone to visit Josh in Ohio? Have you tried RenEx? If so then your opinion might be justified but if not, you're running you mouth based on hearsay. Not a good way to go about life."

You just invalidated you entire argument against RenEx.

fbcoach :"Hahahaha....you are DeadTrap and sggb2112, as well as RW Hawk and a whole host of other fakes. You have to do better than this."

You troll like you train..mindless volume of sets & accounts..goes hand in hand.
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dhitquinn

southbeach wrote:
DeadTrap. wrote:
Joshua Trentine wrote:
4 grade tactics...lol

So true.

That's all they've got.They are not friends of HIT. They do not embrace new knowledge, discovery or the superior technology it beckons. They train the same old ways day after day, year after year (yawn) They worship at the alter of the barbell. It's their religion, their god :/



Yes how dare these guys who are average height (6') and weigh more than 200lbs worship the barbell! They should be worshipping the machines that have built you to less than 190lbs at 6'6" the 6 foot equivalent of weighing 155
lbs
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fbcoach

sgb2112 wrote:
"Have you gone to visit Josh in Ohio? Have you tried RenEx? If so then your opinion might be justified but if not, you're running you mouth based on hearsay. Not a good way to go about life."

You just invalidated you entire argument against RenEx.

fbcoach :"Hahahaha....you are DeadTrap and sggb2112, as well as RW Hawk and a whole host of other fakes. You have to do better than this."

You troll like you train..mindless volume of sets & aick ccounts..goes hand in hand.


If consider 4 sets 2x/week volume, you must have the constitution of a eunich. Stick to embezzling and internet fraud Bob. It suits you better.
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db144

Josh,

Popular? Whatever that means? Either way I don't care.

For someone who claims to be a busy trainer you always seem to manage to find any and all references to RenEx on this forum.

Time will prove or negate RenEx not your words. How could tests be executed when the machines have just arrived? You constantly say you can't execute the RenEx method on anything but a RenEx machine. Is that true for you as well? Doesn't seem so.
Do you understand my skepticism?

When a properly executed study proves your theories correct I'll eat my words but first the studies need to be undertaken. Until then it is just another untested method of weight training that may or may not be better than what I'm using.

The problem here Josh is you have over a decade of your life involved and a pile of cash invested. This is your legacy and as such I don't have on your blinders, my vision is unclouded by ego and financial success.

Sgb:

I'm questioning if this is the best method of training ever devised to this point and my question stands. It is for the person touting such to prove its worth not for me to disprove. Read that a few times so it can sink in as you seem a bit slow.

You've taken up the drumbeat without so much as trying (this is an assumption because I've asked twice with no response) what you say is the greatest advancement in weight training ever. At least Josh has used the method.

I'm a troll? Why because I question statements made by people?

I've never asked you how you train and you've never asked me how I train. I'm not a volume guy and those that discuss my training with me rather than guess, as you have done, know I'm a low volume low rep trainee for the most part. From time to time I throw myself a curve ball but I keep coming back to a low volume low rep method and it has been working quite well, thank you for asking.

d
P.S. Just because you both irritate me doesn't mean I don't like ya.... ;)
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RW Hawk

Virgin Islands

jitterbug wrote:
DeadTrap & sgb 2112

Agreed! The first advancements since AJ.

Edward


fbcoach wrote:
Hahahaha....you are DeadTrap and sggb2112, as well as RW Hawk and a whole host of other fakes. You have to do better than this.


fbcoach,

Why are you accusing Edward (jitterbug) of being myself and sgb2112?

We are three different people.
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