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Determine the Length of Your Workouts

Evaluate Your Progress

Keep Warm-Up in Perspective


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"Doing more exercise with less intensity,"
Arthur Jones believes, "has all but
destroyed the actual great value
of weight training. Something
must be done . . . and quickly."
The New Bodybuilding for
Old-School Results supplies
MUCH of that "something."

 

This is one of 93 photos of Andy McCutcheon that are used in The New High-Intensity Training to illustrate the recommended exercises.

To find out more about McCutcheon and his training, click here.

 

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My X-Force Experience
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J-son

Had the great pleasure to try the X-Force line of machines today (minus the triceps machine).

Training Ren-Ex style last year, using mostly Nautilus Nitro, I wanted to try the machines to see how they perform.

Beeing a HIT-nerd, training for 25 years with some years not training at all, I do know how to train hard with good form. I do think I have a good understanding about training HIT style. That said: now to the actual work out.

I did, in this order:
Leg curl
Leg ext
Leg press
Pullover
Pulldown
Row
Pec dec
Chest press
Incline press
Lat raise
Overhead press
Bi curl
Abs

Total time (I guess), around 30 min. Instead of 3-1-5, my repetitions was more like 5-3-7 ( old dogs you know). I aimed for 4 reps, sometimes the weight was to light (15 reps on the Legcurl), at one time to heavy (3 reps OP).

How was the feeling: Very smoth machines, with to my ability to judge them, not a lot friction, at least better then Nitro/less friction then the Nautilus.

The turnaround was a bit tricky at first, I guess it takes more then one try to really get it and not unloading the muscles when you turn around. The feeling when the weight increased on the neg part of the rep was...really cool. Felt like some body pushed on the stack down, still quite easy to control the weight, inroading and not offroading, IMHO.

Leg curl: Felt very good, nice curve.

Leg ext: as above

Leg press: A lot better then Nitro. Very cool with the added weight down, huffing and puffing now

Pullover: better then Nitro IMO.

Pulldown: More like a chin then a more traditionel pulldown machine. Most try it more before judging it.

Row: I was very tired here, need more experience with it.

Pec dec: Great, with added neg I felt it a lot in the rear delts to, very strange.

Chest press: Hard to get the seat low enough but a lot better still then Nitro, the handels was moving more to the center which I liked.

Incline Press: I was very tired here again, need more experience.

Lat raise: I felt that I sat a bit to upright, it was ok, but here I liked the Nitro better so far.

Overhead press: nice positioning with handels, but I would have liked to press more in front of me then just up. Maybe Im just used to something different here. Time will tell.

Bi curl: cool positioning, very good. Liked it a lot.

Abs: Superb. Never felt anything like it.

Overall, with my limited experience with high qual equipment, Im very positive to X-Force. I was very tired after the wo and I dont want to feel the ache tomorrow, I belive its gonna be massive.

If these machines can produce with one wo/week, I will be a regular client with out a doubt.

//Jonas
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Ellington Darden

Jonas,

I was familiar with X-Force, as I had used it in Sweden and at four different conventions.

When it arrived in Gainesville in mid-January 2012, it still took me three times through to get all the weights and the seat settings and movement-arm setting just right.

The first time was just experimentation.

The second workout was close, but some of the weights were still too high or too low.

The third time through was spot-on. And boy did I feel it on each machine. Afterward, the effects hung around for five days and nights.

So, it will probably take you two more workouts to achieve the true feel of the X-Force machines.

Ellington
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Tony Williams

Jonas,

Do you plan to continue working out once a week on X-FORCE, and do you plan to continue to use all 13 exercises?

Are you planning to continue working out on the machines in the same order as you did in this first workout?

Finally, did you experience any soreness DURING the exercises as some have reported.

Thanks,

Tony
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J-son

Ellington Darden wrote:
Jonas,

I was familiar with X-Force, as I had used it in Sweden and at four different conventions.

When it arrived in Gainesville in mid-January 2012, it still took me three times through to get all the weights and the seat settings and movement-arm setting just right.

The first time was just experimentation.

The second workout was close, but some of the weights were still too high or too low.

The third time through was spot-on. And boy did I feel it on each machine. Afterward, the effects hung around for five days and nights.

So, it will probably take you two more workouts to achieve the true feel of the X-Force machines.

Ellington


Thx for your input. I agree that it probably will take some sessions to get used to them fully.

Regarding frequency: What in your opinion would be most effective: On weekly wo with 15 machines or two with 10 machines. I know the answer should be "try and see", but what would be your choice?

For your information Im doing the diet from your NHITT ( 1500 kcal)with better results then I ever experienced before.

//Jonas
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J-son

Tony Williams wrote:
Jonas,

Do you plan to continue working out once a week on X-FORCE, and do you plan to continue to use all 13 exercises?

Are you planning to continue working out on the machines in the same order as you did in this first workout?

Finally, did you experience any soreness DURING the exercises as some have reported.

Thanks,

Tony


Yes, yes, yes and yes on the leg curl.

I was quite wiped out after the traing yesterday, had to rest for a while before I could move down to the locker room, but today I feel great with soreness in all muscles, but not trashed at all.

//jonas
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entsminger

Virginia, USA

==Scott==
Excellent report Jason!Very helpful!!
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kulitsa

New York, USA

Thank you Jonas, very interesting. If I may suggest, please keep the thread as your training log, would be very interesting to see how will things progress for you.

One of the important questions you have raised here is the frequency.

Is it twice a week, once a week or once in 10 days.

Best of luck with your X-Force training.

Albert
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Ellington Darden

My feelings are that once a week on X-Force is the best frequency. And I recommend 8 exercises for most trainees. Perhaps a few can train with 10 or 12 exercises.

Surprisingly, according to Roger Schwab in Philadelphia, many women do better with a higher number of exercises.

If you're trying to lose fat at the same time as you are building muscle, then 4 or 5 X-Force machines performed twice a week produces excellent results.

Ellington
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J-son

entsminger wrote:
==Scott==
Excellent report Jason!Very helpful!!


Thx, the best way to describe these machines is "smoth". The curve seems to be great on them to.

Remember though, I have never tried MedX and similar brands so maybe Im not experienced enough to compare. Still, a lot better then Nitro or Nautilus One (horrible) IMHO.

//Jonas
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J-son

kulitsa wrote:
Thank you Jonas, very interesting. If I may suggest, please keep the thread as your training log, would be very interesting to see how will things progress for you.

One of the important questions you have raised here is the frequency.

Is it twice a week, once a week or once in 10 days.

Best of luck with your X-Force training.

Albert


Yes frequency is something to really consider with this machines and the added weight on the negative part.

Your idea of keeping it as a log is a great idea.

//Jonas
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J-son

Ellington Darden wrote:
My feelings are that once a week on X-Force is the best frequency. And I recommend 8 exercises for most trainees. Perhaps a few can train with 10 or 12 exercises.

Surprisingly, according to Roger Schwab in Philadelphia, many women do better with a higher number of exercises.

If you're trying to lose fat at the same time as you are building muscle, then 4 or 5 X-Force machines performed twice a week produces excellent results.

Ellington


I guessed you would suggest twice weekly.

In your book: NHITT you write about what AJ would have done different if he would have trained again from the beginning. Basicly less exercises/less frequency. BUT all we know is the result he got from doing what he did, eg 12-15 excercises, 2-3 times per week. So, we have one "what I should have done" and speculations about that result, and one "what he actually did" with great results. My point is (not well described above, I know), why not do as he did instead of what he thought was best (proof of concept vr. speculations).

With X-Force and the deeper possibilty for inroad, wouldent you first manupilate frequency, for recovery, but keeping volume intact if you are able to make it through all machines?

Rambling a bit, guessing a lot, but does it makes sense to anybody?

//Jonas
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J-son

Ellington Darden wrote:
My feelings are that once a week on X-Force is the best frequency. And I recommend 8 exercises for most trainees. Perhaps a few can train with 10 or 12 exercises.

Surprisingly, according to Roger Schwab in Philadelphia, many women do better with a higher number of exercises.

If you're trying to lose fat at the same time as you are building muscle, then 4 or 5 X-Force machines performed twice a week produces excellent results.

Ellington


An alternate way to make up an A - B WO could be:

A
Calves
Leg ext
Leg press
Pullover
Pulldown
Pec dec
Incline press
Lateral raises
Tri ext
Abs

B
Calves
Leg curl
Leg press
Pullover
Row
Pec dec
Chest press
Bi curl
OP
Abs

10 excercises, done once or twice per week.

//Jonas
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Turpin

I agree it would be great if you could/would use your X-force experience as a means to recording a log and perhaps post a pic of your gains from over ( say ) a 6-8 week period.

T.
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J-son

Turpin wrote:
I agree it would be great if you could/would use your X-force experience as a means to recording a log and perhaps post a pic of your gains from over ( say ) a 6-8 week period.

T.


I actually might do that. Very very sore in my shoulders today.

//Jonas
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kulitsa

New York, USA

Ellington Darden wrote:

If you're trying to lose fat at the same time as you are building muscle, then 4 or 5 X-Force machines performed twice a week produces excellent results.

Ellington


Dr.Darden, what machines were used twice a week?

Albert
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Ellington Darden

Albert,

I split the machines into two groups of seven. On Monday the trainees applied either 4, 5, or 6 machines from one group. On Thursday they used 4, 5, or 6 from the other group. They did NOT do two sets of any machine during the week.

Ellington
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J-son

Ellington Darden wrote:
Albert,

I split the machines into two groups of seven. On Monday the trainees applied either 4, 5, or 6 machines from one group. On Thursday they used 4, 5, or 6 from the other group. They did NOT do two sets of any machine during the week.

Ellington


You make me curious of course, what machines was in respective group?

//Jonas
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simon-hecubus

Texas, USA

Ellington Darden wrote:
Albert,

I split the machines into two groups of seven. On Monday the trainees applied either 4, 5, or 6 machines from one group. On Thursday they used 4, 5, or 6 from the other group. They did NOT do two sets of any machine during the week.

Ellington


J-son wrote:
You make me curious of course, what machines was in respective group?
//Jonas


You probably need to separate the exercises that cover the same territory, like Pec Deck one time and Incline Press the next.

A - Leg Ext
B- Leg Press
etc.

UNlike your example, you would NOT do Calves in both sessions. You'd prob do Calves on the day you didn't do the Leg Press, since some calves are involved then.

A - Leg Press
Leg Curl

B - Leg Ext
Calves
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simon-hecubus

Texas, USA

Here's one way to split, IF you want to make each one a whole body workout:

A
Leg press
Leg curl
Pullover
Row
Incline press
Lat raise
Bi curl

B
Calves
Leg ext
Pulldown
Pec dec
Chest press
Overhead press
Abs

Row and Pulldown could probably go either way.

Scott
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J-son

simon-hecubus wrote:
Here's one way to split, IF you want to make each one a whole body workout:

A
Leg press
Leg curl
Pullover
Row
Incline press
Lat raise
Bi curl

B
Calves
Leg ext
Pulldown
Pec dec
Chest press
Overhead press
Abs

Row and Pulldown could probably go either way.

Scott


Thx for your suggestions, probably will do an A-B-C to start of with, twice a week:

A
Leg curl
Leg press
Pec dec
Chest press
Pullover
Pulldown
Overhead press
Bicurl
Tri ext
Abs

B
Leg ext
Leg press
Calves
Pullover
Row
Pec dec
Incline press
Lateral raises
Bicurl
Tri ext

C
Leg curl
Leg ext
Calves
Chest press
Pulldown
Incline press
Row
Lateral raises
Overhead press
Abs

I guess this can be a good starting point to evaulate the machines and protocoll.

//Jonas

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Hitit

J-son wrote:
simon-hecubus wrote:
Here's one way to split, IF you want to make each one a whole body workout:

A
Leg press
Leg curl
Pullover
Row
Incline press
Lat raise
Bi curl

B
Calves
Leg ext
Pulldown
Pec dec
Chest press
Overhead press
Abs

Row and Pulldown could probably go either way.

Scott

Thx for your suggestions, probably will do an A-B-C to start of with, twice a week:

A
Leg curl
Leg press
Pec dec
Chest press
Pullover
Pulldown
Overhead press
Bicurl
Tri ext
Abs

B
Leg ext
Leg press
Calves
Pullover
Row
Pec dec
Incline press
Lateral raises
Bicurl
Tri ext

C
Leg curl
Leg ext
Calves
Chest press
Pulldown
Incline press
Row
Lateral raises
Overhead press
Abs

I guess this can be a good starting point to evaulate the machines and protocoll.

//Jonas



TBH and IMO, you will be hard pressed to maintain that for any extended time period and gain anything except overtraining if you are doing SSTF.

I hope you can prove me wrong.
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simon-hecubus

Texas, USA

J-son wrote:
Scott
Thx for your suggestions, probably will do an A-B-C to start of with, twice a week:

A
Leg curl
+9

B
Leg ext
+9

C
Leg curl
+9

I guess this can be a good starting point to evaulate the machines and protocoll.
//Jonas


Hitit wrote:
TBH and IMO, you will be hard pressed to maintain that for any extended time period and gain anything except overtraining if you are doing SSTF.

I hope you can prove me wrong.


Jonas,

I agree with Brian, but if you have this much of a head-of-steam going, then we probably can't stop you.

Just stay vigilant for when those rep and poundage increases stall-out and be prepared to start dropping exercises.

Go too hard for too long, and simply dropping exercises won't be enough.

Best Regards,
Scott
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J-son

Hitit wrote:
J-son wrote:
simon-hecubus wrote:
Here's one way to split, IF you want to make each one a whole body workout:

A
Leg press
Leg curl
Pullover
Row
Incline press
Lat raise
Bi curl

B
Calves
Leg ext
Pulldown
Pec dec
Chest press
Overhead press
Abs

Row and Pulldown could probably go either way.

Scott

Thx for your suggestions, probably will do an A-B-C to start of with, twice a week:

A
Leg curl
Leg press
Pec dec
Chest press
Pullover
Pulldown
Overhead press
Bicurl
Tri ext
Abs

B
Leg ext
Leg press
Calves
Pullover
Row
Pec dec
Incline press
Lateral raises
Bicurl
Tri ext

C
Leg curl
Leg ext
Calves
Chest press
Pulldown
Incline press
Row
Lateral raises
Overhead press
Abs

I guess this can be a good starting point to evaulate the machines and protocoll.

//Jonas



TBH and IMO, you will be hard pressed to maintain that for any extended time period and gain anything except overtraining if you are doing SSTF.

I hope you can prove me wrong.


Because no one can take 10 exercises? Im glad AJ dident know that... :-)

You could be right, lets try and see!

//Jonas
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simon-hecubus

Texas, USA

J-son wrote:
Because no one can take 10 exercises? Im glad AJ dident know that... :-)


No need to be snide about it.

It's a simple matter of probability. What has the better odds:

1. That you are like most other people?

2. That you are one of the gifted right-end-of-the-bell-curve few?

(Hint: If you were #2, you probably wouldn't be here asking for others input, 'cause you'd be big no matter what)
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J-son

simon-hecubus wrote:
J-son wrote:
Because no one can take 10 exercises? Im glad AJ dident know that... :-)


No need to be snide about it.

It's a simple matter of probability. What has the better odds:

1. That you are like most other people?

2. That you are one of the gifted right-end-of-the-bell-curve few?

(Hint: If you were #2, you probably wouldn't be here asking for others input, 'cause you'd be big no matter what)


Not trying to be "snide" what ever that means. The tone level is so low on this forun now, that even if you try to joke, people get upset, thats nothing but amazing.

Disagree with your "logic". Hint: the bell curve example isent valid in this discussion. Lets leave it there. I simply try and see so we dont have to guess. May be I even kearn some thing from it that maybe somebody else can learn from. That would be great.

//Jonas
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